First Fox

[ernestf321]

Good day everyone, truly appreciate the opportunity to share this with ya'll, thank you. I recently purchased a Fox 12ga and was looking for some help in determining what this Fox truly is. After doing some research, I've determined the shotgun was made in 1922, but other than that, I'm not quite sure what grade it would be. Any help would be greatly appreciated. I know she's rough, but I'm hooked.

Thanks

[vaturkey]

You have a 12 gauge Sterlingworth gun there. The following will provide info on all the various grades they put out:

https://www.foxcollectors.com/fox-gun-grades

[ernestf321]

You have a 12 gauge Sterlingworth gun there. The following will provide info on all the various grades they put out:

https://www.foxcollectors.com/fox-gun-grades

Thank you!

[Jeff S]

Welcome aboard, and I'm sure you'll love that Sterlingworth. It's a great gun.

[ernestf321]

Welcome aboard, and I'm sure you'll that Sterlingworth. It's a great gun.

Truly appreciate it. I need to find a good gunsmith that can check it out for me. My goal is to hunt with it. I have a new GSP and I'd love to use this double. My concern is not being sure what load to use. Seems as though it's chambered just shy of 2 3/4".

[Jeff S]

Those are fine dogs. You'll learn that there are a lot of "dog guys" on this forum. As for the length of the chambers, I'm really not the guy to talk to. However, I think that I have gathered from the other members that Fox made the chambers a smidge short to insure a nice tight fit. As for ammo, I'm sure that most low brass, 1 oz loads will work fine. Many of us, myself included, order low pressure loads from RST simply to "play it safe". These old guns are fun to shoot and the RST shells work great. Enjoy it.

[ernestf321]

Thanks Jeff!

[Researcher]

FOX CHAMBERS --

The only two A.H. Fox Gun Co. catalogues, that I have seen, that state chamber lengths are the 1913 and 1914. They both state 12-gauge guns are regularly chambered for 2 3/4 - inch shells, 16-gauge 2 9/16 – inch shells and 20-gauge 2 1/2 - inch shells.

1914 catalog

That being said, virtually every 12-gauge Ansley H. Fox gun made in Philadelphia (other than the HE-Grade Super-Fox) that I've run a chamber gauge in shows about 2 5/8 - inch. The chambers of unmolested 16-gauge guns seem to run about 2 7/16 inch and 20-gauge guns a hair over 2 3/8 inch. A very few graded guns were ordered with longer chambers. Savage began stating chambered for 2 ¾ inch shells in their 1938 Fox catalogues.

All this being said there is a good body of evidence that back in those days chambers were held about 1/8 inch shorter than the shells for which they were intended. In the book The Parker Story the Remington vintage specification sheets on pages 164 to 169 call for a chamber 1/8-inch shorter than the shell for which it is intended. Also in the 1930's there were a couple of articles in The American Rifleman (July 1936 and March 1938) on the virtue of short chambers. A series by Sherman Bell in The Double Gun Journal showed no significant increase in pressure from shooting shells in slightly short chambers. IMHO I don't much sweat that 1/8-inch in 12-gauge guns. On the other hand when one gets a 20-gauge chambered at 2 3/8-inch likely intended for 2 1/2-inch shells I do worry about folks firing 2 3/4-inch shells in such guns.

FWIW I've been shooting nominally 2 3/4 inch shells in my 12-gauge Ansley H. Fox doubles with 2 5/8 inch chambers for 53 years. For high volume shooting at clay targets and Doves I favor light handloads of 7/8 ounce at 1200 fps to be easy on old wood and me. However, I've regularly carried a 3 3/4 dram equiv, 1 1/4 ounce Remington Express or such in the left barrel of old "Meat in the Pot" my 1914 vintage A-Grade when after wild Pheasants.

[ernestf321]

Wow, thank you Researcher!