Fox Baltimore Md

RHP · Post by **RHP** » Sun Dec 23, 2012 6:23 am

I have a 12ga double barrel marked Fox Gun Co Balto MD USA. It appears to have damascus barrels and I've heard that this are not safe to fire modern 12ga shells. Should I just keep it as a wall hanger or are shells available that are safe to shoot? The gun appears to be in good working condition but it has not been fired in at least 40 years.
Thanks Rick in Baltimore

Post by **fox-admin** » Sun Dec 23, 2012 10:28 am

Rick: Most would advise you to have the damascus barrels inspected by a qualified sxs gunsmith. Many people are shooting low pressure RST shells from damascus guns on a routine basis.
http://www.rstshells.com/
Post pictures of your gun, we would be interested. Craig

Researcher · Post by **Researcher** » Sun Dec 23, 2012 11:05 am

There are two grades known of Fox Gun Co., Balto., MD., U.S.A. guns, the A-Grade with Twist barrels and the B-Grade with Damascus barrels. Tom Kidd did an article on this short-lived (July 1898 to Jan. 10, 1900) company in The Double Gun Journal, Volume Nine, Issue 4. I did an article on the Fox Gun Co., Balto., MD., U.S.A. and its successor Baltimore Arms Co. in The Gun Report, Volume 42, Number 9, February 1997.

I have one complete gun and bits of two others, all three A-Grades. Of interest, the bores in the two sets of barrels I have all measure quite tight -- .708" & .712" and .710" & .713", and both sets are chambered for the longest 12-gauge shells offered at that time 3 1/4 inches. The 3 1/4 inch 12-gauge shell was only offered for bulk smokeless powders, and wasn't factory offered with a load any heavier than one could get in the 2 3/4 inch 12-gauge shells, but carried more and better wadding. It appears from my very limited sample that Ansley was very concerned with a good gas seal early on. Would love to see some specs for others Fox Gun Co., Balto., MD., U.S.A. guns.

Probably less than a thousand of these guns were built in the company's brief lifetime. The highest serial number observed has been 975, and both 975 and 966 both survive as just receivers.

RHP · Post by **RHP** » Sun Dec 23, 2012 1:39 pm

Thanks for the info. This one is # 3xx . as best I can measure with a Starret Mic. the barrels are .709" on the left and .714" on the right.
I can try to get some better pictures if the is any interest.

Researcher · Post by **Researcher** » Sun Dec 23, 2012 3:58 pm

Great!! We like pictures! That is the first Fox Gun Co., Balto., MD., U.S.A. gun I've ever seen with a straight grip. All the others I've seen are a half-pistol grip like this on my No. 153 --

Some good close-up pictures of the markings on the barrel flats and watertable would be great. I can't really tell in your pictures whether those are Damascus or Twist barrels. Also, what are the length of the barrels? The guns I've recorded with serial numbers lower than yours don't have anything marked on the top-tang by the safety button, but those I've seen with higher serial numbers have the word SAFE stamped in the top tang.

RHP · Post by **RHP** » Sun Dec 23, 2012 5:25 pm

The barrel lenght is 27 3/4" and it does have "safe" above the saftey. There are no other markings on the outside. I've never had this gun apart but I will get some better pics in the next couple of days. The damascus swirles are more pronounced near the end of the barrels.

RHP · Post by **RHP** » Tue Dec 25, 2012 6:11 am

Looks like this is a "B" model

Researcher · Post by **Researcher** » Tue Dec 25, 2012 12:05 pm

Great pictures. Thank you for sharing. 332 is the second B-Grade I've recorded. The other is 345 that was shown in Tom Kidd's article in The Double Gun Journal, Volume Nine, Issue 4. Unfortunately, with that odd barrel length, the barrels of No. 332 have very likely been cut off, loosing any choke they may have had. All the Fox Gun Co., Balto., MD., U.S.A. guns I've recorded with uncut barrels were either 30- or 32-inch length. If I may ask for one more picture, it would be great to see a close-up of the top of the breech end of the barrels. In his article, Tom made a point of a difference in the way the rib extension was made between the A- and the B-grades. As one can barely see in this picture, the rib extension on an A-Grade is a short piece brazed or soldered in place --

RHP · Post by **RHP** » Tue Dec 25, 2012 1:16 pm

Here you go!!! Is there any definitive way to determine if the barrels were shortened? I'm pretty confident that the above mesurements of .709" and .714" are acurate. That would make them about the same as the bore on your 30" barrels. Or was it common for someone to shorten a barrel by 2"?

Researcher · Post by **Researcher** » Tue Dec 25, 2012 3:29 pm

Certainly looks like this B-Grade has a rib extension made like the A-Grade guns. Maybe the one Tom showed is just very well fitted and the line doesn't show?!? The muzzle of those barrels look "right" with the tubes touching. Maybe they started life as 28-inchers and were just shortened a bit to clean up some damage.

RHP · Post by **RHP** » Wed Dec 26, 2012 5:46 pm

Well let me know if you want any other pictures or measurements. This gun is not going anywhere any time soon, it's been in the family for a long time. Unfortunately the only person that may have known it's history passed away 15 years ago.
Now I just have to figure out which RST shell to order.

RHP · Post by **RHP** » Fri Feb 08, 2013 9:02 pm

Well, I finally got a chance to go out to the range and shot 25 rounds of the RST Premium Grade 2 3/4 " Lites. It was a pleasure to shoot, nice patterns. After cleaning , the barrel looked good as new.
We're going to try some skeet shooting this weekend.
Thanks Rick

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