So, Bo Whoop is sold and is now in the DU museum. Obviously there were either no legal issue sor they were somehow resolved to the satisfaction of all parties involved.
does anyone have any idea what finally happened. Seeing how there werre so many arm chair lawyers on a number of boards that were talking all kinds of legal doom and gloom, I for one, as a layman would be interested in how the question of legal posession versus stolen protperty and the estates claims to same were handled.
I am sure that was all resolevd before Julias ran the gun but its interesting that there is no comment from the 'experts" now.
Just my .02
Bo Whoop legal concerns; how were they resolved????
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Brian
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Bo Whoop legal concerns; how were they resolved????
Brian
LTC, IN, USAR
Back in the land of the big PX
Life Member A.H. Fox Gun Collectors Assoc
President For Life- Southwest Asia Chapter AHFGCA
LTC, IN, USAR
Back in the land of the big PX
Life Member A.H. Fox Gun Collectors Assoc
President For Life- Southwest Asia Chapter AHFGCA
-
Germantown
Re: Bo Whoop legal concerns; how were they resolved????
Armchair and Philadelphia lawyers hey? I recall a wise Sicilian Don who once said "One lawyer can steal more than a hundred men with guns can"!! Legal- Schmegal-- the DU lads are astute enough not to have accepted the generous gift from the son of the late Hal Bowen Howard unless they were certain they had clear title, as they do with the gift of the second Bo-Whoop.
What difference does it make now- Mr. Julia made a handsome profit, as he always seems to do on rare guns sold, DU and Nash's hometown are also the beneficiaries- let's not be "a fixin' what ain't already broke" here!!
What difference does it make now- Mr. Julia made a handsome profit, as he always seems to do on rare guns sold, DU and Nash's hometown are also the beneficiaries- let's not be "a fixin' what ain't already broke" here!!
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Brian
- Posts: 358
- Joined: Fri Jan 05, 2007 10:55 pm
- Location: Delaware County, NY
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Re: Bo Whoop legal concerns; how were they resolved????
Just curious. so many legal expertd before speaking doom and gloom to whomever had it sequestered for all these years. Low and behold , nothing happened. just sort of entertaining.
Brian
LTC, IN, USAR
Back in the land of the big PX
Life Member A.H. Fox Gun Collectors Assoc
President For Life- Southwest Asia Chapter AHFGCA
LTC, IN, USAR
Back in the land of the big PX
Life Member A.H. Fox Gun Collectors Assoc
President For Life- Southwest Asia Chapter AHFGCA
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mike campbell
- Posts: 385
- Joined: Sun Jan 07, 2007 3:29 pm
Re: Bo Whoop legal concerns; how were they resolved????
This article is from Garden & Gun Magazine. http://gardenandgun.com/article/legend- ... page=0%2C0
The Legend of Bo Whoop
More than sixty years ago, the South's most famous shotgun went missing. Here's the story of how it was found
On December 1, 1948, two hunters emerged from the cool wetlands of Clarendon, Arkansas, and ambled along a country road. The men—Nash Buckingham and Clifford Green—had spent a long morning in a duck blind and were headed back to Green’s car, on their way home. Buckingham, then sixty-eight years old, was at the time one of the most famous writers in America, a sort of Mark Twain for the hunting set. At Green’s car, they met a warden, who asked to see their hunting licenses. The warden quickly realized that he was in the presence of the celebrated writer. He asked Buckingham if he could see the most famous shotgun in America, Buckingham’s talisman, an inanimate object that the writer had referred to—in loving, animistic terms—in a great number of his stories. The nine-pound, nine-ounce gun was a side-by-side 12-gauge Super Fox custom-made by the A. H. Fox Gun Company in Philadelphia.
The carbon steel plates on the frame were ornately engraved with a leafy scroll. The gun company’s signature fox, nose in the air, was engraved on the floorplate. The barrels had been bored by the renowned barrel maker Burt Becker and delivered 90 percent patterns of shot at 40 feet, an uncharacteristically tight load for a waterfowling shotgun. It was named Bo Whoop. A hunting buddy had designated it so, after the distinct deep, bellowing sound it made upon discharge.
The warden chatted up Buckingham, handling and admiring the writer’s gun, like a kid talking to Babe Ruth while holding the slugger’s bat. At some point during the conversation, the warden laid the gun down on the car’s back fender. Buckingham and Green soon bid the warden farewell and drove off, forgetting about Bo Whoop until many miles into their trip home. In a panic, they turned around and retraced their route, painstakingly eyeing every inch of the road, to no avail.
Buckingham spent the next few years in a desperate hunt for Bo Whoop. He lamented the loss of Bo Whoop in print, likening it to the death of a treasured hunting dog. He took out ads in local newspapers, offering rewards. He befriended local wardens and police, appealing to them to be on the lookout.
He would never find it. But in the process of its loss and failed recovery, its legend grew in stature. Bo Whoop became a metaphor for other things gone and never to be retrieved, like one’s youth or the American wilderness. It became the object of intense speculation and hearsay. Reports of Bo Whoop’s discovery surfaced regularly over the years. The gun was once supposedly displayed behind the counter in a southern Illinois pawnshop, only to disappear again, hastily, into the hands of a wealthy coal baron, before its identity could be verified. A man once fabricated a Super Fox, adhering to the specifications Buckingham had left behind in print, and sold it as Bo Whoop before being outed as a fraud. Bo Whoop became like the Russian duchess Anastasia, who purportedly died in the Bolshevik Revolution but kept turning up all over the world, different women claiming to be the youngest daughter of the last czar, still alive. Belief in the existence and reemergence of Bo Whoop required a great leap of faith. It became the province of dreamers.
The legend befitted its mythmaker. Theophilus Nash Buckingham was born in Memphis in 1880. He attended Harvard University in 1900, where his boxing coach was “Gentleman” Jim Corbett. There he contracted malaria and went home for a year to convalesce. When he recovered, he enrolled at the University of Tennessee, where he was the captain of the football team in 1902 (the team went 6-2). He pitched for the Memphis Chickasaws, a minor-league baseball team.
Buckingham was a man of idiosyncrasies. He was impeccably tidy in appearance, rarely seen in public without his tweed jacket and tie. He was a business owner, running a sporting goods store in the 1920s. Yet he never owned a house or a car, and never learned to drive. He was reportedly prone to moments of extreme forgetfulness, sometimes unable to recall the name of his own bird dog.
Buckingham was also a strident conservationist. He covered conservation topics in the hundreds of pieces he penned for magazines like Field & Stream, Outdoor Life, and Sports Afield. He produced nine books (some were collections of his magazine stories), the most famous being De Shootinest Gent’Man & Other Tales, published in 1934 by the Derrydale Press. His writings sometimes veered into the pervasive sentimentality of that time, and some of his attempts at local dialect—particularly that of Southern blacks—are nearly indecipherable (he was no Twain in that regard). But Buckingham very often rose to the occasion in print, penning bons mots that must have induced knowing smiles and nods from his dedicated flock of readers. They loved him for lines like: “A duck call in the hands of the unskilled is conservation’s greatest asset.” They loved him for creating a legendary life for a shotgun.
In 1950 two considerate friends made Buckingham another Fox, named Bo Whoop II. But the original, in the mind of its erstwhile owner, would never be replaced. Buckingham died in 1971, two months shy of his ninety-first birthday.
Lost & Found
Sometime in the 1950s a foreman at a sawmill in Savannah, Georgia, was offered an elegant but well-used Fox shotgun with a broken stock. The seller wanted $100. The Savannah foreman took one look at the fractured stock and countered with an offer of $50. The sale was made at that price. The foreman then put the gun in his closet, where it remained for the next three decades.
The foreman’s son, who also lived in Savannah, eventually inherited the gun upon his father’s death. He, too, left the gun in his closet, this time for nearly twenty years. But in 2005, for reasons unknown (the consignor’s family wishes to remain anonymous), he brought the gun to Darlington Gun Works, a South Carolina shop owned by Jim Kelly, a noted gunsmith. The foreman’s son wanted to repair the broken stock. Kelly, a student of hunting history, saw that on the top of the right barrel there was a hand stamp that read: “Made for Nash Buckingham.” On the top of the left barrel: “By Burt Becker Phila. PA.” Kelly was floored. “I couldn’t believe that this gun had walked right in here,” he says. He contacted a Fox historian to help verify what his own eyes had told him. The historian confirmed that this gun was indeed very likely Bo Whoop. Kelly told the foreman’s son what it was that he owned, trying to impress upon the man that the gun had significant historical importance. The foreman’s son seemed unmoved. He insisted on a replica stock, then took the repaired gun home.
Four years later, the foreman’s son fell ill. By that time he had passed the shotgun down to his son, the last of the three generations of a Savannah family that would own it for five decades. This man, in part to help defray medical costs for his sick father, decided it was time to sell it. He contacted James Julia, a personable sixty-three-year-old lifelong Mainer. Julia owns a leading auction house in Fairfield, Maine, that specializes in decorative glass and lamps, toy dolls, antiques and Americana, and, most famously, firearms.
In 2007 the James D. Julia Auction Company sold a shotgun nicknamed the Czar’s Parker for $287,500, the most expensive American shotgun in history. Parker had made the gun for Czar Nicholas II in 1914, but the gun was never delivered due to the czar’s unexpected execution at the hands of the Bolsheviks. In 2008 Julia sold the second-highest-earning American shotgun in history, an L. C. Smith 16-gauge with glittering gold barrel inlays that went for $235,750.
Julia was consigned Bo Whoop in late 2009. He knew he had something special, a shotgun that could perhaps approach his previous records. “But we had no idea how much potential this gun had until the word got out,” he says. News of Bo Whoop’s potential discovery burned up blogs on the Internet. “There was as much talk about this gun as anything I’ve auctioned in forty years in the business,” Julia says. When he displayed the shotgun at an antique firearms show in Las Vegas, a snaking line of people lined up all day, waiting patiently to look at, photograph, and hold the gun.
But a few sticky issues remained for Julia before he could sell it. One was verifying that the shotgun was indeed the real thing. Despite the hand stamps with Buckingham’s and Becker’s names, there was a problem with the serial number. Buckingham had once written in a letter that the number on Bo Whoop was 31108. But the serial number on the gun in Julia’s hands was 31088. Julia consulted a Fox archivist who said that the company did indeed have a gun with the former number, but that it was not from the Super Fox series that had been made for Buckingham. The latter number—the one in Julia’s possession—was the correct one for Buckingham’s gun, however. “I think it’s pretty obvious that Buckingham transposed a few numbers,” says Julia. It would not have been out of character for a man who was famously forgetful.
With that issue put to rest, Julia had an even more pressing problem: Who actually owned the gun? A lost or stolen item could very well be legally claimed by a family member. Julia says he spent months trying to get in touch with Buckingham’s daughter, who was believed to be still living. He never received a response. “We were in a touchy position,” Julia admits. Then he discovered that Buckingham had written in a book called Dear John—a collection of letters written to a hunting friend—that he had insurance on Bo Whoop. The story seemed to indicate that he’d been paid a settlement. “It was like manna from heaven,” Julia says.
What it meant was that the Buckingham family had no legal rights to the gun. Furthermore, Julia believes that the insurance company, if it still existed, would have only had claim to the money it had paid out, which Julia estimated would have been around $400, a sum he would have gladly paid back. Julia says he never tried to find the insurance company, but that it is “virtually impossible to have an ownership issue” for the gun. The matter was settled in his mind. Julia guaranteed ownership before the auction, which was to take place on March 15.
Bidding War
In early March, news of the impending auction caught the attention of an eighty-four-year-old man named Hal Howard, Jr., a former executive at T. Rowe Price. Howard, who speaks with the elegant accent of the Southern gentry, was born and raised in Memphis and still tends to his grandfather’s estate there, but he now lives in Palm Beach. He heard about the auction from his son-in-law in Vermont. “He saw it on e-mail,” Howard says. “And he told me it was happening in Maine of all places.”
Howard, as it turns out, had a vested interest in the shotgun: He was Buckingham’s godson. His father, Hal Howard, Sr., was not only Buckingham’s best friend and hunting partner, he was also the single most mentioned character in Buckingham’s stories. Howard, Sr., had died of a heart attack at age fifty-two when Junior was eight years old. Buckingham had penned a heartfelt elegy to the elder Howard, in a story called “Hail and Farewell.” The writer remained a presence in the younger Howard’s life until his death in 1971. “We hunted in Arkansas together,” says Howard, Jr. “And when my son was born, Nash stopped by and signed a book with a sentimental inscription and so forth.” Buckingham never talked about Bo Whoop with Howard (“I was around well after Bo Whoop’s time,” he says), but Howard immediately decided that he had to have the gun, to complete some cosmic circle.
On the day of the auction, Howard had business to attend to, so he put a “younger cousin” in charge of the bidding, which was done by phone. “I told him to call me on my cell phone if the price got close to two hundred thousand dollars,” Howard says. He was determined to get the gun. “I didn’t want it to end up in Kansas City or somewhere where it had no relevance,” he says. The bidding on that day moved along quickly until it reached $100,000. Then the pace slowed as the field was narrowed to two people: One was Howard’s cousin, the other was a gun collector. The bidding went up in increments of $5,000 until Howard won it at $175,000. With the buyer’s premium, the final cost came to $201,250, the third-highest sum ever paid for an American shotgun.
Howard’s identity remained a mystery until April when it was announced that he was doing something wholly unexpected by the gun-collecting community: He was donating the gun to Ducks Unlimited (DU), a waterfowl conservation group in Memphis, in honor of his father’s relationship with Buckingham. To Howard, it was the perfect home for Bo Whoop. Howard had previously donated a diorama of Buckingham and his father’s camps, books, and journals that is displayed in DU’s front lobby. DU sits on property where Buckingham once hunted doves.
Howard, a hunter all of his life, has never fired the gun and never will. He has macular degeneration in his right eye, “and I don’t want to risk getting gunpowder in my left eye and going completely blind,” he says. He has stipulated that a few DU employees who are true Buckingham enthusiasts can shoot it before it goes on display. “I see this as an excellent completion of their memory and friendship,” Howard says.
The Legend of Bo Whoop
More than sixty years ago, the South's most famous shotgun went missing. Here's the story of how it was found
On December 1, 1948, two hunters emerged from the cool wetlands of Clarendon, Arkansas, and ambled along a country road. The men—Nash Buckingham and Clifford Green—had spent a long morning in a duck blind and were headed back to Green’s car, on their way home. Buckingham, then sixty-eight years old, was at the time one of the most famous writers in America, a sort of Mark Twain for the hunting set. At Green’s car, they met a warden, who asked to see their hunting licenses. The warden quickly realized that he was in the presence of the celebrated writer. He asked Buckingham if he could see the most famous shotgun in America, Buckingham’s talisman, an inanimate object that the writer had referred to—in loving, animistic terms—in a great number of his stories. The nine-pound, nine-ounce gun was a side-by-side 12-gauge Super Fox custom-made by the A. H. Fox Gun Company in Philadelphia.
The carbon steel plates on the frame were ornately engraved with a leafy scroll. The gun company’s signature fox, nose in the air, was engraved on the floorplate. The barrels had been bored by the renowned barrel maker Burt Becker and delivered 90 percent patterns of shot at 40 feet, an uncharacteristically tight load for a waterfowling shotgun. It was named Bo Whoop. A hunting buddy had designated it so, after the distinct deep, bellowing sound it made upon discharge.
The warden chatted up Buckingham, handling and admiring the writer’s gun, like a kid talking to Babe Ruth while holding the slugger’s bat. At some point during the conversation, the warden laid the gun down on the car’s back fender. Buckingham and Green soon bid the warden farewell and drove off, forgetting about Bo Whoop until many miles into their trip home. In a panic, they turned around and retraced their route, painstakingly eyeing every inch of the road, to no avail.
Buckingham spent the next few years in a desperate hunt for Bo Whoop. He lamented the loss of Bo Whoop in print, likening it to the death of a treasured hunting dog. He took out ads in local newspapers, offering rewards. He befriended local wardens and police, appealing to them to be on the lookout.
He would never find it. But in the process of its loss and failed recovery, its legend grew in stature. Bo Whoop became a metaphor for other things gone and never to be retrieved, like one’s youth or the American wilderness. It became the object of intense speculation and hearsay. Reports of Bo Whoop’s discovery surfaced regularly over the years. The gun was once supposedly displayed behind the counter in a southern Illinois pawnshop, only to disappear again, hastily, into the hands of a wealthy coal baron, before its identity could be verified. A man once fabricated a Super Fox, adhering to the specifications Buckingham had left behind in print, and sold it as Bo Whoop before being outed as a fraud. Bo Whoop became like the Russian duchess Anastasia, who purportedly died in the Bolshevik Revolution but kept turning up all over the world, different women claiming to be the youngest daughter of the last czar, still alive. Belief in the existence and reemergence of Bo Whoop required a great leap of faith. It became the province of dreamers.
The legend befitted its mythmaker. Theophilus Nash Buckingham was born in Memphis in 1880. He attended Harvard University in 1900, where his boxing coach was “Gentleman” Jim Corbett. There he contracted malaria and went home for a year to convalesce. When he recovered, he enrolled at the University of Tennessee, where he was the captain of the football team in 1902 (the team went 6-2). He pitched for the Memphis Chickasaws, a minor-league baseball team.
Buckingham was a man of idiosyncrasies. He was impeccably tidy in appearance, rarely seen in public without his tweed jacket and tie. He was a business owner, running a sporting goods store in the 1920s. Yet he never owned a house or a car, and never learned to drive. He was reportedly prone to moments of extreme forgetfulness, sometimes unable to recall the name of his own bird dog.
Buckingham was also a strident conservationist. He covered conservation topics in the hundreds of pieces he penned for magazines like Field & Stream, Outdoor Life, and Sports Afield. He produced nine books (some were collections of his magazine stories), the most famous being De Shootinest Gent’Man & Other Tales, published in 1934 by the Derrydale Press. His writings sometimes veered into the pervasive sentimentality of that time, and some of his attempts at local dialect—particularly that of Southern blacks—are nearly indecipherable (he was no Twain in that regard). But Buckingham very often rose to the occasion in print, penning bons mots that must have induced knowing smiles and nods from his dedicated flock of readers. They loved him for lines like: “A duck call in the hands of the unskilled is conservation’s greatest asset.” They loved him for creating a legendary life for a shotgun.
In 1950 two considerate friends made Buckingham another Fox, named Bo Whoop II. But the original, in the mind of its erstwhile owner, would never be replaced. Buckingham died in 1971, two months shy of his ninety-first birthday.
Lost & Found
Sometime in the 1950s a foreman at a sawmill in Savannah, Georgia, was offered an elegant but well-used Fox shotgun with a broken stock. The seller wanted $100. The Savannah foreman took one look at the fractured stock and countered with an offer of $50. The sale was made at that price. The foreman then put the gun in his closet, where it remained for the next three decades.
The foreman’s son, who also lived in Savannah, eventually inherited the gun upon his father’s death. He, too, left the gun in his closet, this time for nearly twenty years. But in 2005, for reasons unknown (the consignor’s family wishes to remain anonymous), he brought the gun to Darlington Gun Works, a South Carolina shop owned by Jim Kelly, a noted gunsmith. The foreman’s son wanted to repair the broken stock. Kelly, a student of hunting history, saw that on the top of the right barrel there was a hand stamp that read: “Made for Nash Buckingham.” On the top of the left barrel: “By Burt Becker Phila. PA.” Kelly was floored. “I couldn’t believe that this gun had walked right in here,” he says. He contacted a Fox historian to help verify what his own eyes had told him. The historian confirmed that this gun was indeed very likely Bo Whoop. Kelly told the foreman’s son what it was that he owned, trying to impress upon the man that the gun had significant historical importance. The foreman’s son seemed unmoved. He insisted on a replica stock, then took the repaired gun home.
Four years later, the foreman’s son fell ill. By that time he had passed the shotgun down to his son, the last of the three generations of a Savannah family that would own it for five decades. This man, in part to help defray medical costs for his sick father, decided it was time to sell it. He contacted James Julia, a personable sixty-three-year-old lifelong Mainer. Julia owns a leading auction house in Fairfield, Maine, that specializes in decorative glass and lamps, toy dolls, antiques and Americana, and, most famously, firearms.
In 2007 the James D. Julia Auction Company sold a shotgun nicknamed the Czar’s Parker for $287,500, the most expensive American shotgun in history. Parker had made the gun for Czar Nicholas II in 1914, but the gun was never delivered due to the czar’s unexpected execution at the hands of the Bolsheviks. In 2008 Julia sold the second-highest-earning American shotgun in history, an L. C. Smith 16-gauge with glittering gold barrel inlays that went for $235,750.
Julia was consigned Bo Whoop in late 2009. He knew he had something special, a shotgun that could perhaps approach his previous records. “But we had no idea how much potential this gun had until the word got out,” he says. News of Bo Whoop’s potential discovery burned up blogs on the Internet. “There was as much talk about this gun as anything I’ve auctioned in forty years in the business,” Julia says. When he displayed the shotgun at an antique firearms show in Las Vegas, a snaking line of people lined up all day, waiting patiently to look at, photograph, and hold the gun.
But a few sticky issues remained for Julia before he could sell it. One was verifying that the shotgun was indeed the real thing. Despite the hand stamps with Buckingham’s and Becker’s names, there was a problem with the serial number. Buckingham had once written in a letter that the number on Bo Whoop was 31108. But the serial number on the gun in Julia’s hands was 31088. Julia consulted a Fox archivist who said that the company did indeed have a gun with the former number, but that it was not from the Super Fox series that had been made for Buckingham. The latter number—the one in Julia’s possession—was the correct one for Buckingham’s gun, however. “I think it’s pretty obvious that Buckingham transposed a few numbers,” says Julia. It would not have been out of character for a man who was famously forgetful.
With that issue put to rest, Julia had an even more pressing problem: Who actually owned the gun? A lost or stolen item could very well be legally claimed by a family member. Julia says he spent months trying to get in touch with Buckingham’s daughter, who was believed to be still living. He never received a response. “We were in a touchy position,” Julia admits. Then he discovered that Buckingham had written in a book called Dear John—a collection of letters written to a hunting friend—that he had insurance on Bo Whoop. The story seemed to indicate that he’d been paid a settlement. “It was like manna from heaven,” Julia says.
What it meant was that the Buckingham family had no legal rights to the gun. Furthermore, Julia believes that the insurance company, if it still existed, would have only had claim to the money it had paid out, which Julia estimated would have been around $400, a sum he would have gladly paid back. Julia says he never tried to find the insurance company, but that it is “virtually impossible to have an ownership issue” for the gun. The matter was settled in his mind. Julia guaranteed ownership before the auction, which was to take place on March 15.
Bidding War
In early March, news of the impending auction caught the attention of an eighty-four-year-old man named Hal Howard, Jr., a former executive at T. Rowe Price. Howard, who speaks with the elegant accent of the Southern gentry, was born and raised in Memphis and still tends to his grandfather’s estate there, but he now lives in Palm Beach. He heard about the auction from his son-in-law in Vermont. “He saw it on e-mail,” Howard says. “And he told me it was happening in Maine of all places.”
Howard, as it turns out, had a vested interest in the shotgun: He was Buckingham’s godson. His father, Hal Howard, Sr., was not only Buckingham’s best friend and hunting partner, he was also the single most mentioned character in Buckingham’s stories. Howard, Sr., had died of a heart attack at age fifty-two when Junior was eight years old. Buckingham had penned a heartfelt elegy to the elder Howard, in a story called “Hail and Farewell.” The writer remained a presence in the younger Howard’s life until his death in 1971. “We hunted in Arkansas together,” says Howard, Jr. “And when my son was born, Nash stopped by and signed a book with a sentimental inscription and so forth.” Buckingham never talked about Bo Whoop with Howard (“I was around well after Bo Whoop’s time,” he says), but Howard immediately decided that he had to have the gun, to complete some cosmic circle.
On the day of the auction, Howard had business to attend to, so he put a “younger cousin” in charge of the bidding, which was done by phone. “I told him to call me on my cell phone if the price got close to two hundred thousand dollars,” Howard says. He was determined to get the gun. “I didn’t want it to end up in Kansas City or somewhere where it had no relevance,” he says. The bidding on that day moved along quickly until it reached $100,000. Then the pace slowed as the field was narrowed to two people: One was Howard’s cousin, the other was a gun collector. The bidding went up in increments of $5,000 until Howard won it at $175,000. With the buyer’s premium, the final cost came to $201,250, the third-highest sum ever paid for an American shotgun.
Howard’s identity remained a mystery until April when it was announced that he was doing something wholly unexpected by the gun-collecting community: He was donating the gun to Ducks Unlimited (DU), a waterfowl conservation group in Memphis, in honor of his father’s relationship with Buckingham. To Howard, it was the perfect home for Bo Whoop. Howard had previously donated a diorama of Buckingham and his father’s camps, books, and journals that is displayed in DU’s front lobby. DU sits on property where Buckingham once hunted doves.
Howard, a hunter all of his life, has never fired the gun and never will. He has macular degeneration in his right eye, “and I don’t want to risk getting gunpowder in my left eye and going completely blind,” he says. He has stipulated that a few DU employees who are true Buckingham enthusiasts can shoot it before it goes on display. “I see this as an excellent completion of their memory and friendship,” Howard says.
Beware the man with one gun...he likely will bore you to death in others ways, too.
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eightbore
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Re: Bo Whoop legal concerns; how were they resolved????
Is the fake Bo Whoop mentioned in the Garden and Gun article a part of Fox collecting lore? I'm not sure I remember hearing about that one. Can anyone fill us in? How about those 90% patterns at 40 feet? I'm not teasing the author, but it was the first thing I noticed when G&G came in the mail Monday.
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George Lander
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Re: Bo Whoop legal concerns; how were they resolved????
Mike: Thanks for sharing that great article about Bo Whoop. When I visited Jim Kelly's shop and he invited me to the back room to look at something special I'll have to admit that I didn't know much about Nash Buckingham and nothing about Bo Whoop. I had read "The Shootingest G'enman" but that's about all. I started a thread on the Doublegun BBS and on this forum that I had seen the "holy grail" of shotguns and was immediatedly castigated as a thief, a liar, et. al. A few good folks came to my rescue and over time I was proved correct.
Bill" There is a long thread on the Doublegun BBS that mentions the fake Bo Whoop that someone had made from the original specs written about by Nash. I don't know any more than that.
Best Regards, George
Bill" There is a long thread on the Doublegun BBS that mentions the fake Bo Whoop that someone had made from the original specs written about by Nash. I don't know any more than that.
Best Regards, George
"Therefore, never send to know for whom the bell tolls. It tolls for thee"......John Donne
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Germantown
Re: Bo Whoop legal concerns; how were they resolved????
Any man who quotes John Donne's immortal poem can't be all bad or all wrong. Cheap critics and carping carbetbaggers still abound, sure there will be coveted and rare shotguns once owned by a prominent member of the outdoorsporting press, at least the late Augustus Pachmayer identified his "counterfeited" Parkers and Model 21's as his work- the more ornate the better, but he was old school (Alt Schul, Jawohl)--
The nice thing about this story ending, besides the big fat grin on Mr. Julia's kisser as he trucks to the bank, is that the fabled shotgun will be on display in Memphis at DU HQ- for all to see- Can't say the same about the Czar's Parker A-One Special, does Mr. Puglisi still have that prize??
The nice thing about this story ending, besides the big fat grin on Mr. Julia's kisser as he trucks to the bank, is that the fabled shotgun will be on display in Memphis at DU HQ- for all to see- Can't say the same about the Czar's Parker A-One Special, does Mr. Puglisi still have that prize??
Last edited by Germantown on Wed Jun 09, 2010 8:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Brian
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Re: Bo Whoop legal concerns; how were they resolved????
Thanks. That explains it. Funny how I never saw the arm chair legal experts really weigh in on the insurance angle.
interesting and settled.
interesting and settled.
Brian
LTC, IN, USAR
Back in the land of the big PX
Life Member A.H. Fox Gun Collectors Assoc
President For Life- Southwest Asia Chapter AHFGCA
LTC, IN, USAR
Back in the land of the big PX
Life Member A.H. Fox Gun Collectors Assoc
President For Life- Southwest Asia Chapter AHFGCA
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ASavageFox
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Re: Bo Whoop legal concerns; how were they resolved????
My understanding is tha Puglisi had that Parker sold before he ever bought it... or within minutes after...Germantown wrote:Any man who quotes John Donne's immortal poem can't be all bad or all wrong. Cheap critics and carping carbetbaggers still abound, sure there will be coveted and rare shotguns once owned by a prominent member of the outdoorsporting press, at least the late Augustus Pachmayer identified his "counterfeited" Parkers and Model 21's as his work- the more ornate the better, but he was old school (Alt Schul, Jawohl)--
The nice thing about this story ending, besides the big fat grin on Mr. Julia's kisser as he trucks to the bank, is that the fabled shotgun will be on display in Memphis at DU HQ- for all to see- Can't say the same about the Czar's Parker A-One Special, does Mr. Puglisi still have that prize??
Cheers!
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Germantown
Re: Bo Whoop legal concerns; how were they resolved????
Thanks- I had also heard the same. As Mr. Puglisi has some high prices for his high condition Parkers, and I believe he paid 275K plus the commission, makes me wonder what his client ended up paying for that rare Parker. Interesting in that both that Parker and now the first Bo-Whoop had been restocked, at least the buttstock- and both were fairly heavy 12 bores with 32" long barrels tightly choked--
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Researcher
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Re: Bo Whoop legal concerns; how were they resolved????
George Bird Evans mentioned a "fake BoWhoop" showing up at a gun show in his writings, but there are so many errors in his writings about Nash and Harold B. Money that I doubt George would have recognized BoWhoop if he had it in his hands. George's bit about the "water faucet" top lever sure doesn't track with the pictures ofg BoWhoop in Nash's books!!
Share the knowledge
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Fowlgunner
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Re: Bo Whoop legal concerns; how were they resolved????
So, does the gentleman from Savannah owe inheritence taxes on the difference of $50 dollars and what the hammer price was? Just curious?
Fowlgunner
Fowlgunner
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ASavageFox
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Re: Bo Whoop legal concerns; how were they resolved????
depends on what it was worth when he inherited it....could have been 20 -30-40 years ago ....
I doubt inheritance tax but would assume income or capital gain tax to some extent...but then again... who cares.... its got nothing to do with the gun, its originality, nor its place in history today so I don't see how its relevant to this website.
I doubt inheritance tax but would assume income or capital gain tax to some extent...but then again... who cares.... its got nothing to do with the gun, its originality, nor its place in history today so I don't see how its relevant to this website.
Cheers!
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eightbore
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Re: Bo Whoop legal concerns; how were they resolved????
Tax talk concerning personal property gives me a chuckle. If we buy a lawnmower at a yard sale for five bucks and it turns out to be Patton's lawnmower and worth twenty grand, do we get taxed on the difference? No, because it's all part of running a household, you win some you lose some, but it has cost more than $19,995 to run a household, so there is no profit.
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Fowlgunner
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Re: Bo Whoop legal concerns; how were they resolved????
Well, since the original topic of this thread is about "Legal Concerns" I felt it was an appropriate question.
Are taxes legally due in this case or one similar?
If he had been left $50 worth of stock that had appreciated to nearly $200k, I know what the answer is. Is there any difference in the eyes of the law?
Thanks,
Will
Are taxes legally due in this case or one similar?
If he had been left $50 worth of stock that had appreciated to nearly $200k, I know what the answer is. Is there any difference in the eyes of the law?
Thanks,
Will