Fox Collectors

I'm looking at a Fox Sterlingworth 12 gauge for sale locally and I'm interested to see what it's worth. The serial number is 161267 and comes with two sets of barrels. It has a straight grip English stock and a Beavertail forend with a rubber recoil pad. The 30 inch barrels are marked Savage arms Corp Chicopee falls Mass. There is a blemish at the end of the barrel where the bluing has come off. The second set of barrels are 26 inches and marked Savage arms Corp Utica Ny. With 2 3/4 inch chambers. All pieces have matching serial numbers, there are no bulges or dents in the barrels and with a quick check with a barrel gauge both barrels are choked IM and Full.

Welcome to the forum, BF12.

Couple things that I notice that I would have concern about. First, there has been some damage to, or a botched attempt at repair to, the rear of the top rib and rib extension. I've never seen damage quite like that, and it would require careful examination to determine the level of soundness of the rib in that area. Next, the restock of the butt doesn't seem to be mating well with the rear of the action. There appears to be a gap between the wood and the action on the forward area of the cheek panel. It may be only a shadow, but that area absorbs much of the recoil from firing, and proper fit there is pretty important to prevent movement and subsequent damage/cracking/splitting of the stock head. That could be addressed with bedding, if the gun was intended to be a shooter, but I'd be very concerned about the top rib. Proper repair of that would be prohibitively expensive.

As to value, I'd have to be able to buy the gun for the value of only a one barrel set gun, shooter grade, and that's very subjective. IMO, the set with the damaged rib has very little value.

All my best, SRH

Not a good gun. Not a good deal at almost any price. Only a Savage letter will tell you whether it is a scarce model, like a Skeet and Upland.

161267 is one of the very last Sterlingworths produced and I would bet the 26" barrels are for a SUGG.

I haven't recorded any Fox-Sterlingworth Skeet & Upland Game Guns above serial number 160818. Those guns I've recorded from 160840 on up all had the capless pistol grip stock. All the guns I've recorded above the serial number of the gun in question have been SP- or "Drawbolt" frame guns. That stock doesn't look quite right for a Skeet & Upland Game Gun stock. The stock cheeks are too defined, the checkering comes too close to the cheeks and the nose of the comb is fluted. A couple of "right" Fox-Sterlingworth Skeet & Upland Game Guns --
I'd like to see some better pictures of those Chicopee Falls barrels off the gun so we can see the lug and rib extension. Wondering if someone worked over a set of Stevens barrels to fit a Fox-Sterlingworth receiver?

It looks re-stocked. But the question remaining is it a SSUGG or Sterlingworth Brush.

Thanks for the info, here are some more pictures

I don't think that Fox is factory.

Are there individual forearms for each set of barrels or has one forearm been made to work with both? Usually when the factory added a second set of barrels there was a 2 stamped under the serial number on the barrel flats and the forearm iron of the forearm for that set of barrels.
As long as the original set of 26-inch barrels are sound, the gun still has to be a $600 shooter.

Good feedback from several of the members here. Depending on price may or may or may not be a good buy. Stan pointed out the most important items that would need attention.

Researcher...quick question. I recently looked at a SSUGG gun that had a set of Chicopee Falls barrels serial numbered to the gun as well as a set of Philadelphia era barrels also numbered to the gun. Have you seen Chicopee Falls barrels on a SSUGG? All my catalogs are in storage, what year was the SSUGG’s introduced? Thanx - Brett

Introduced in 1935.

Thanks Jason. I thought it was post Savage. The Philly barrels are obviously an added set.

A few years back Jay Shachter had a Fox-Sterlingworth Skeet & Upland Game Gun with Chicopee Falls barrels. I figured it had been back to Savage for new barrels for some reason. I've seen Chicopee Falls barrels on probably a couple of dozen Ansley H. Fox guns over the years.

Savage Arms Corp. consolidated their arms making operations at their old J. Stevens Arms Co. factories at Chicopee Falls in 1947, turning the Utica, NY, factory over to making items for the post-war housing boom.

From what can be seen in the pics I'd say the Chicopee barrels weren't factory fitted and that prompts questions, if the interferences and clearances are proper. Just because they work and fire doesn't mean they're right. Also I don't see a discernable proof mark.

The back end of the top rib was obviously filed, and the breeches look to be rounded off to match with the breech balls (fences). JFI - some 12-gauge barrels both later Savage/Utica and Chicopee seem to have been deliberately made quite a bit oversize at the breech end, to be fitted to a variety of left-over frame forgings that were/had been languishing in stock.

frank

Quite frankly amazed that no one has yet addressed the hand-stippled rendition of the primitive Fox on the floorplate! Mesmerizing design and equally chaotic execution - could be a Hopi Indian wisdom motif or just as likely a woodland spectator woven into the Bayeaux Tapestry depicting the Battle of Hastings. Foxes rule the world!