16 Sterlingworth hard to open...

[CableguyJJS3]

An odd situation here guys, or odd to me at least. I recently purchased a nice clean 16ga Philly Sterlingworth and finally got a chance to make some clay dust with it today. The gun functions flawlessy, loaded or unloaded, everything works and feels as it should. The action is nice and smooth, opens easy and locks up tight, lever sits about 5:30. However when I shoot it, I open the lever and have to all but put it over my knee to force it open, and a few times I did have to rest the bottom on the reciever on the 2x4 that made up the shooting window and force it open. I know this is not right and all day long I thought about it while I was shooting it and I can't for the life of me think of a reason why it would do that. Once I get it to open after I shoot it, it goes right back to opening and closing free and easy. It's almost like the recoil is jamming the action somehow, but I can't figure out how. I was using low pressure shells, same as I use with no issues in my 16ga L.C. Smith, same brand I use in my Parker Trojan 12 and my Fox B grade 12 with no issues. Any ideas or thoughts are appreciated. Thanks.

[Twice Barrel]

Take a look at the primers on a few of your fired shell to see if there is any evidence that the firing pin is dragging when the gun is opened. Some primers are soft and don't allow the firing pins to properly retract after firing. I have had this problem on a couple of my 16 gauge Foxes when using promotional loads that use Cheddite primers. I have not had this problem with my reloads using Federal or Winchester primers.

[CableguyJJS3]

I did check the primers for good contact, I had good contact and no drag marks that I saw. They were factory Federal Skeet loads that I was using today. I did not look to see if the pins were retracting though. But it only does this under recoil, if I drop the hammers with the chambers empty, no issues. But could still be the pins dragging I suppose, even though no drag marks, I didn't look at that. I'll have to check the pins when I fire it next.

[jolly bill]

Cableguy,

Does your 16 gauge Sterlingworth have factory original 2 9/16 inch chambers? If so, that could be your problem when using 2 3/4 inch shells, even low pressure loads.

If the chambers have been lengthened to 2 3/4", try shooting some Remington shells. They seem to have harder primers and the firing pins do not extend into them as much.

I have two 12 gauge Foxes that are difficult to open after firing some ammo. I reload using Remington primers and that solved my problem.

Hope this helps.

Jolly

[CableguyJJS3]

If I had to guess, it has the original chamber lengths. It's a 351xxx number and from what I can tell, it has never had any work done to it whatsoever. All the screw heads are absolutely pristine and in line, same for the pins. I know that wouldn't do anything for chambers, but the condition leads me to believe the gun has been used, not abused, cared for but never worked on for any reason. I was using 2 3/4" shells, but they did drop in fully with no effort, I didn't have to push them in at all. And after they were fired, once I got the action open, they pulled right out with no effort. And the binding issue, it wasn't like when I tripped the lever it opened a little then hung, the lever opened under normal effort but the barrels refused to lift out of the reciever in the slightest until I leaned on it. I'm really baffled with all this, I guess I'll have a few more things to pay attention to next weekend. Thanks for the help and ideas so far guys.

[fox shooter]

I've experienced this same problem once in awhile with my 1929 Sterly 12. It's only when I fire both barrels though. I break the gun open over the top of my thigh! I load both Win. and Rem. using both primers. Like yours, the gun is used but not abused. Sometimes I wonder if there's a little swelling in the brass? Let me know if you find the cause.
Chris....AZ

[jolly bill]

Cable guy,

A modern unfired 16 gauge 2 3/4 inch shell is about 2 1/2 inches long and will easily drop in a 2 9/16 inch chamber with no problem. After the shell is fired will it measure 2 3/4". Using a machinists scale and some correct lighting, you may be able to measure the chambers of your 16.

Try refroming one of your fired shells so it is full size the entire length and see if that will chamber all the way. Or cut a fired 16 gauge shell in two just ahead of the brass and use it as a chamber gauge. See how far it goes in before there is resistance. Do this with the barrels off the gun so the extractors don't influence your testing.

If the firing pins extend too far into the standing breech/primers, that can give you problems. I have an early A grade 12 gauge whose firing pins extend about 0.010 inches more into the standing breech than one of my 12 Ga S'worth's. That A grade is very difficult to open after firing. In my case, that can be overcome by using Remington primers. Simply eliminates that problem. I hand load so easily fixed for me. Remington shells (with Rem primers) may help your situation if your gun has longer extended firing pins and your gun is chambered for 2 3/4 inch shells.

Please let us know your chamber length.

Jolly

[CableguyJJS3]

It's been a busy week here, so I haven't had a chance to look into this anymore. This weekend however I plan to shoot again and get out my meausring tools and see what's what. I will let you guys know what I find. Thanks for the input so far, I appreciate it.

[Kimber06]

Cable Guy
Have you tried a different manufacture's shell? I have an AYA that hangs up the same as your Fox every time I use Winchester AAs. No problem with any other manufacture's shells. Was told it had to do with the depth that the primer was seated. Don't know if that is true or not, but the problem is repeatable in my gun. Just one more thing to consider.

[CableguyJJS3]

I've talked to a bunch of different people about this, and that seems to be the concensus, hot shells sticking in the chamber. I will know something after tomorrow though, I am attending a charity shoot and I plan to use my 16. I deliberately went and bought a different brand of shells to test this theory out, hopefully I have no issues. If I do though I will bring my B grade 12 as a backup until I do figure this out. Thanks for the help and advice guys, I appreciate it.

[Researcher]

In my experience, in 12-gauge guns, it has nothing to do with the "hotness" of the shells used. It is the primer. If I load my 7/8 ounce, 1200fps, 6300 psi loads in a AA hull with Winchester primers, in some guns the firing pins stick making the gun hard to open. That is why I regularly load my 7/8 ounce, 1200fps, 6300psi loads in Remington STS hulls with Remington primers. The firing pins stick far less in Remington primers. Period. Holds true that in a 3 3/4 dram equiv. 1 1/4 ounce high velocity load some guns stick on the Winchester shell, but not on the Remington Express Long Range. I personally haven't had the problem in one of my 16-gauge Fox guns, so I load a lot of 1 ounce loads in compression formed Winchester hulls with a Winchester 209 primer. For clay targets I do my 16-gauge 7/8 ounce loads in the purple Federal hull with a Winchester 209.

[CableguyJJS3]

Well another 100 rounds on the sporting clays range today, and no issues. The gun functioned as it should, no flaws whatsoever, except for the guy that was pointing it and missing, but that's another issue alltogether. The first time I shot it, Federal shells, sticking in the primers or the brass expanding in the chamber whatever, this round, Remington shells, no issues at all. I'll but another box of the Federals and see if I can determine if it's the primers or the brass, but at least I know everything does function as it should. Thanks for the help guys.

[Twice Barrel]

Simple to determined if it is the case just get out the old calipers and measure a couple of each brand. I'm betting that your Federals were loaded with a lot of soft primers not too common but stuff happens. If you don't plan to reload and don't expect a long case life the black Remington's are perfectly serviceable. If you do plan to reload the Remington Express hull is a much better choice but the initial cost will be more.

[CableguyJJS3]

I will measure out everything next time I can. I'll probably try to find a few different manufacturers shells and test them out. Though I do intend to make my own loads for this 16, I am not currently setup. However that day is coming fast, so if anyone has any leads on new empty Remington hulls, I'd appreciate that. All I have found so far is Cheddite and Fiocchi.

[Twice Barrel]

With the current cost of components it is more economical to buy loaded ammunition and have fun making your own empties. Additionally with the current manufacturing method of using steel heads I strongly recommend that you invest in a loader that uses a reisizing system like the MEC Sizemaster or purchase a MEC Supersizer. I have been using the Supersizer for a number of years and don't remember ever loosing a hull due to a deformed case head.