Fox Collectors

A guy sent me some email pics of a DE fox. I only got a few close ups. He just bought it last week and from the totally new condition I am seeing, I am wondering if it is a newer Galazan version. Don't have a serial #.

Any tell tale signs I could look for to differentiate. I may get to examine it in hand, but it is a couple hundred miles away right now.


thanks


Charlie

Charlie,all the new Foxes have scalloped frames and only a few specials on older guns has that feature.The new Foxes are marked CSMC i believe.It has been a long time since i sold mine and cannot remember a lot about it. Bobby

Thanks Bobby. This one does not have a scalloped frame, so most likely an original vintage fox. Will have to get it in hand to look for a restoration.


Charlie

Charlie, are we gonna get to see this gun?? Hope so.

tjw

here goes - let me know what you think - ( I spent an hour reducing this pics. will try again.)

Thanks Charlie, looks like a heck of a gun. Smallbore??....looks like it to me. Tell me about the single trigger, is it a Kautzky?

tjw

WOW nice gun. Charlie I edited your pictures so they fit better, hope you don't mind. The only thing my eye sees is the lack of frame rebates on the top and bottom of the action and the layout of the checkering pattern is a little different from the D's I have inspected. That being said most of the D's are a little different since so few where made. It appears to have a miller trigger??? What is the serial number??. Craig

I second the two preceding comments. On the trigger, the back end of its blade part has an abrupt shoulder like on a Miller; but the gold barrel selector markings look like a Kautzky setup. Do you have pictures of the water table, barrel flats and barrel legends? Last comment, the serial number should tell the story. Silvers

This one has not been offered for sale, so I'm waiting on an invite to check it out. Hope to see it in hand in a couple weeks. Thanks for all the helpful hints on what to look for. Any comments on original finish vs re-do?

If its a small bore, i may never own it.

I may have better pics of the trigger.

Charlie

A fellow collector reminded me that some of very early D's did not have frame rebates so the lack of rebates may not mean much if it is a early example. Also, it does not have the gargoyles on the breech balls (at least that I can see). It's impossible to tell if the finishes are correct but my guess is the metal finishes look correct. My guess is it was re-stocked as a straight grip and a Miller trigger replacement.

What I am seeing is a late-style Miller single trigger with the rocker selector at the front of the trigger. With the gold L and R on the trigger plate, it appears the gun had some kind of earlier single trigger, probably a Fox-Kautzky. It appears that perhaps the big trigger plate screw had been damaged at some point along its life and was cleaned up and hit with a torch to recolor.

All in all a great looking gun.

Had a discussion with a Fox comrade earlier today about this gun, and Kautzky triggers. IME they are the most reliable of the earlier single triggers. And the Kautzky reliability can be compared favorably even against modern single triggers. So far I've owned nine Foxes with Kautzkies, have shot all of them a lot to include switching barrels frequently to test the function, and have never had a single malfunction. Seven of these guns had factory-installed triggers, and two were in QUALITY restocks.

Now, I do know of one Fox with a Kautzky, owned by a friend, that doubled quite frequently while we were shooting togther at the VC - but that was in a Fox with an unknown restock and at least two earlier "repairs" to the trigger.

I offer all this as background for those who've heard about problems with early single triggers in other makers' guns. Joe Kautzky was a genius IMO.

Assuming this DE Fox came with a Kautzky and it now has a Miller (also an excellent trigger) - why would someone have changed it out? Rhetorical question.... Silvers

That's a nice looking fox. Hope it works out for you.

Do any "of us" know of a AH Fox factory single selective trigger other than a Kautzky????......I don't, but I am always hungry for for info.

Fox-Admin, Im thinking like you but the early D's and the late D's are very different as we know, but this one looks like a later "2nd gen" in engraving and checkering patterns. Again I agree with you with the absence of the rebates. Hmmmm?

tjw

Hmmm.... Just the opposite of DIANA. On this gun the breechballs are profiled to the barrels, but it doesn't have the frame rebates. FWIW, Headrick's comment on page 106 of the currant DGJ "...the tops of the fences aren't filed down to the rib as in all later guns of XE Grade and higher", souldn't say "all", perhaps "many" or "a majority", but certainly not "all"!! As long as I'm picking nits. also on page 101 Bill states that the GE-Grade's final mention was in the 1929 price list at $1026. Actually it was still included in the January 2nd, 1930, Retail Price List at $1026.00; and in the January 2, 1930, Price List--For Dealers Only at $864.00 Cost to Dealers Net and $1026.00 Cost to Consumers Net.