Fox Collectors

Here's some show and tell re: Super Foxes that most of us have read about but may not have seen by way of a comparison.

I'm having an 0 frame Super Fox restocked and I brought the old stock home yesterday. Layed it down next to a regular 12 gauge stock for comparison. That piece of wood resting across the 0 frame cheek - left side - is 1/4" thick. You can readily see the gap and difference in widths of the two stock heads. There is a shiny reflection on the cheek of the right side regular stock. Notice also the difference in the wood bearing (compressed wood) where the frame recoil had transmitted to both heads.

Recently I've become aware that some of the lighter Super Foxes of ~8-1/2 pounds were made on the regular 12 gauge frame. The one on the left was intended for the Biggest of the Big Boys, >9 pounds or so gun weight. Silvers

Frank, when will we see the finished product?

FWIW Guys,
I recently ran across a HE made on a super frame that weighed at 8# 4 oz
with 32" barrels. he barrels were around 10 ounces lighter than my other H framed guns
That was the sweetest handling HE I have hefted (of a very small pool).

Hello Jess, thanks for your reply. When you say "Super Frame" I presume the watertable is stamped H and the side panels have the correct H grade engraving. However at 8-4 with 32" barrels I'm wondering if the frame on the gun you ran across is the regular 12 gauge size across its back end where it bears against the head of the stock? Also as measured across the breech balls?

I recently saw a lighter 12 bore Super Fox and while it had the correct H stamp and H style engraving, it was built on the regular 12 gauge size frame and it barrels were stamped 1-weight, not 0-weight as made for the larger frame. I took measurements and confirmed that. It did handle like a dream as compared with my 0 framed Big Boy. The 1-weight barrels on this lighter SF were profiled somewhat differently than a set of 1-weights on a CE I own. Frank

Frank by super frame I mean a full sized H frame.

Interestingly enough the barrels lock up properly and fit evenly on the action of my 9# + HE. The 0 was removed from the barrels be they are the 0 size.
Obiviouly they had been heavy struck as the production card stated 8# 4oz also. The gun is very well balanced.

I have measured 30+ 12 ga HE frames across the boss. They range from 2.424 down to 2.405 most measure 2.408 to 2.412. There appears to be no relationship with the weight of the gun and the measurement across the boss. Except for one gun all off the SF's under 9lbs are later guns (over about 30500 serial number) I would be interested in the boss measurement of guns under 8 1/2lb.
I measured a CE that weighted 8 3/4 lbs and the frame measured as a Super Fox frame but the factory card just said heavy as possible (plus the barrels measured .729 standard bores).
Also, MANY custom ordered HE's had a customer requested weight of NOT OVER 8 1/2 pounds and the gun as made came in at over 9lbs (surprise!!)

Hello Craig, when you say across the bosses I assume you mean across the breech balls, or the fences as I suppose is proper nomenclature. I inspected an HE a few days ago that letters as an HE, is stamped H on the watertable and has H engraving on the frame. Measurement across the bosses is 2.360", same as three different standard 12 gauge guns I compared with. Width across the back of the frame is 1.760" - very close to the same three regular 12 gauge frames used for comparison. That same measurement is 1.840" on my 0 frame HE that's currently being restocked.

This one HE recently inspected was built on a regular 12 gauge frame not the larger 0 frame. Record card for this gun shows it was built under 8-8. It is not my gun. Frank

Sorry yes across the breech balls. Almost all of the later HE's are under 9lbs, almost all of the early guns are over 9lbs. It seems as if after about serial number 30555 a switch went off and the guns are under 9lbs?? Very interesting but not sure why with out further measurements.