Super Fox questions

Hayden · Post by **Hayden** » Tue Jul 22, 2008 10:24 am

Silvers, I currently own Super Fox s/n 28399 that letters with factory 3" chambers but is not stamped 3 in on the barrel flats or anywhere else on the gun. I have had the chambers measured to confirm the chamber length and as Don said it was very difficult for the gunsmiths to confirm the chambering due to the tight chambering. Additional information included in the letter stated: 30" barrels choked 70% right and full left,
walnut stock, 13 3/4" LOP, drop at the heel 2 7/8",weight 9 pounds.
Notes: half-pistol grip, 3'" chamber, single trigger
The gun was shipped October 18, 1923. FWIW this is the only Super Fox I have ever seen with the factory single trigger.
Hope this helps.
Best, Hayden

jolly bill · Post by **jolly bill** » Tue Jul 22, 2008 2:50 pm

Here's one:

12 Gauge HE SN 27855 with a Fox SST, AE with two sets of barrels shipped to Peoria Arms Co. Nov. 3, 1923 with:

32" barrels choked F & F with light scroll engraving at the breech with 3" chambers and its own fore end. The fore end had a Parker style metal fore end tip. Original, I don't know and I don't remember if the barrel flats were marked 3" but I think it had the "Barrels not . . etc."

30" barrels choked M & F with the standard HE type fore end.

Gun weighed 9# even with the 32 " barrels and 8# 6 oz with the 30" barrels.

Originally the 30" tubes had 2 3/4" chambers but I had them lengthened to 3". I hunted geese with these barrels on the gun and appreciated the slight weight reduction. Yeah, I know, I'm a candy ass.

Roe Clark's letter just mentions the 32" barrels and its 3" chambers choked F/F and 9# weight and stock full pistol grip of 14 1/8" LOP and 2 1/2" drop at heel. Does not say anything about the engraving on those barrels or the Parker type fore end tip. So I guess the 30" bbl's and fore end were added later. The letter mentions nothing about the Fox Kautsky single selective trigger that was on the gun. It had an older Pachmyer pad on it the last I seen the gun about 10 years ago.

And another one:

12 gauge HE SN 31561 with 30" barrels choked M and F and marked 3" and "Barrels not, etc . . ." on the barrel flats. Weighs about 8# 6 oz with a hard rubber butt plate. No factory letter on this one.

How about a 3rd one:

20 gauge HE SN 202290 with 32" barrels choked F and F that is marked "Barrels not, etc . . " on the barrel flats. Gun has 2 1/2" chambers and weighs 8# 4 oz. Shipped to "Ray A. Sigmond" on March 9, 1925 with full PG and 14 1/8" LOP and 2 3/4" DAH. It has an old Jostam Anti Flinch recoil pad on it.

Jolly

Don Ay · Post by **Don Ay** » Tue Jul 22, 2008 3:10 pm

Frank,
In regards to barrel lengths I have keep a record of HE's Ive seen- heard of- talked to owners of-and jotted down the ser#& relative specs etc. and of the 60 I have recorded 11 have 30" barrels
and only three two barrel sets

loggy · Post by **loggy** » Wed Jul 23, 2008 6:41 pm

Don,
I will send you a pm. Thanks -John

bbman3 · Post by **bbman3** » Wed Jul 23, 2008 9:35 pm

birdawg, i sold the Wildfowl to a man in Maryland 10 years or so ago. Only had one set of barrels, factory buttplate. Bobby

eightbore · Post by **eightbore** » Sun Sep 14, 2008 6:30 pm

What is the latest Philly marked HE serial number and what is the earliest Utica marked serial number? I just saw a Philly marked HE #33,514. That is pretty close to Utica numbering. What Utica guns, whatever grade, are close to 33,514?

Researcher · Post by **Researcher** » Sun Sep 14, 2008 7:24 pm

I know guns in the 3305x range that were shipped in the early months of 1930 and only carry pure Philadelphia markings. I haven't really kept a record on graded guns, but in 20-gauge Sterlingworths the transition covers a span of nearly 3000 serial numbers.

eightbore · Post by **eightbore** » Sun Sep 14, 2008 8:28 pm

OK, here's an even weirder question. Do we think there is any possibility that the Wildfowl guns may have been H Grade frames that had an additional "1" added to the serial number to conform to the Sterlingworth serial number range? What is actually the highest serial number of Philadelphia marked graded guns?

Researcher · Post by **Researcher** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 11:13 am

There are actually some Fox-Sterlingworth Wildfowls that have come to light with graded gun serial numbers on the 351xx range. I guess we'd need to ask John Callahan to see if graded gun cards exist in the 34103 to 34130 range. Eight Fox-Sterlingworth Wildfowls I've recorded are in that 134103 to 134130 range.

eightbore · Post by **eightbore** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 12:52 pm

bbman, was the Wildfowl you sent to MD #134,119? I had the chance to purchase #134,119 in MD and screwed it up.

eightbore · Post by **eightbore** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 1:22 pm

I brought one of the HE boomers home from the parking lot at the Chantilly VA show yesterday, weighed it at 8-6, thought it may be a small frame gun since it has skinny barrels and is light. However, I put the calipers on it this morning and it's an 0 Frame, 1929 serial number, Philly gun. The chokes are .043 and .050 in .736 bores. They are just all different, it seems. I wonder if they just keep drilling them out until they get a good pattern? I may have given a little more info in the "Chantilly show-July" thread when I posted last night. Just a little more detail, it is a full pistol grip gun, don't know how many of those are out there. It has a plain cap, black, polished. The grip has a tighter curve than my early gun #27,850. I will leave the Redhead pad on there until I see the order card. Anyone have a letter that specifies a Redhead pad? This pad may be original since it doesn't look like it was used enough to wear out a Jostam pad. I'm betting that it came with a buttplate. I can't wait to run a couple of my slow reloads of 1 1/4 ounces of soft #4 lead through it. They shot about 95% out of a Sterly with .042 chokes and similar bore size to the new HE. Neither this gun, #33,514 or #27,850 is marked "Not Guaranteed" and both have 2 3/4" chambers. How about that?

loggy · Post by **loggy** » Wed Sep 17, 2008 7:29 pm

I have a Utica HE number 34643 that shipped on 9/25/31.

eightbore · Post by **eightbore** » Wed Sep 17, 2008 8:34 pm

Thanks, Loggy. Now we're getting somewhere. Anyone have Super Foxes between 33,514 and 34,643? What are the barrel markings?

loggy · Post by **loggy** » Thu Sep 18, 2008 5:28 pm

The gun letters and is stamped with 3 inch chambers. There is not a guranteed stamp. I hope that helps as well.