Fox Collectors

In my mind I remember seeing an XE-Grade with a pigeon on the bottom instead of the Fox. Anyone have that gun?

Researcher wrote: ↑Tue Nov 21, 2023 2:35 pm In my mind I remember seeing an XE-Grade with a pigeon on the bottom instead of the Fox. Anyone have that gun?

Dave I remember that XE also but have not seen it in a few years. Here are my two XE head down 12ga XE's

If my memory is correct, one of the founding fathers has an XE with a quail on the underside. Am I correct?

Here's one of those head down Fox's. Sniffing where other Fox's have been?

(Not the best pictures. Gun looks better in hand.)

Very nice Bill.

Jeff S wrote: ↑Tue Nov 21, 2023 3:09 pm If my memory is correct, one of the founding fathers has an XE with a quail on the underside. Am I correct?

If I remember correctly one of our founding Life Members got a 26” XE 12 bore with a bird (quail, grouse?) in place of the fox. One of the guns from our friend the late Billy Harris. frank

Silvers wrote: ↑Tue Nov 21, 2023 4:38 pm

Jeff S wrote: ↑Tue Nov 21, 2023 3:09 pm If my memory is correct, one of the founding fathers has an XE with a quail on the underside. Am I correct?

If I remember correctly one of our founding Life Members got a 26” XE 12 bore with a bird (quail, grouse?) in place of the fox. One of the guns from our friend the late Billy Harris. frank

Great memory Frank. Haven't heard from PP in a long time.

thanks guys, never tire of looking at those beautiful XEs fred

Silvers wrote: ↑Tue Nov 21, 2023 7:45 am Steggy, let's go with C Grade (as in school) on your Foxy education lapse. The head down Fox that looks like a hog searching for acorns (long time members joke) is the earlier version.

Nothing on my Want list. I've pretty much shaken off the collector bug and have been selling guns I don't or rarely use, and am now down to a small number of favorite shooting and hunting Foxes and some other makers. But admittedly I'm still tempted with occasional relapses on straight grippers, 28" barreled small bores and 32" 12's. I prefer those with just a modicum of engraving and decent but not drop dead wood. No sense to me to pay a premium for either. Original or properly restored/customized. I've long moved past hoping to make a nice profit on rare or high condition Foxes that come on the market. Besides stock dimensions one of my key buy considerations is: how difficult is it going to be when sooner or later I want to move the Fox or whatever to a next owner? So many fellas out there who want good vintage guns but only with good dimensions and mechanics and at bargain basement pricing. It's basically a Buyer's marker and getting more so as older gents pass and younger ones have little interest in Fox gun nuances. frank

Steggy, Frank gave me a "C" Grade on a recent off line question. Tough teacher.

I agree with all of the above especially the dying interest in vintage SxS. In my opinion from my gun club, there is a somewhat interest in SxS but not vintage. It's about a shooter SxS and the CZ or Beretta or Stevens line. A few have true vintage (there is one 20g SW open choked all original that was member's grandfathers gun that I would like to have) but overall the view is a SxS is a SxS and they don't shoot as good/easy (harder to hit targets) than an O/U so not worth paying a premium. And younger hunters are looking for "how many shells can I load because more shots fired of 3" shells with 1 1/2" oz of shot means I have a better chance of downing the bird."

Maggiemollie wrote: ↑Tue Nov 21, 2023 6:13 pm

Silvers wrote: ↑Tue Nov 21, 2023 7:45 am Steggy, let's go with C Grade (as in school) on your Foxy education lapse. The head down Fox that looks like a hog searching for acorns (long time members joke) is the earlier version.

Nothing on my Want list. I've pretty much shaken off the collector bug and have been selling guns I don't or rarely use, and am now down to a small number of favorite shooting and hunting Foxes and some other makers. But admittedly I'm still tempted with occasional relapses on straight grippers, 28" barreled small bores and 32" 12's. I prefer those with just a modicum of engraving and decent but not drop dead wood. No sense to me to pay a premium for either. Original or properly restored/customized. I've long moved past hoping to make a nice profit on rare or high condition Foxes that come on the market. Besides stock dimensions one of my key buy considerations is: how difficult is it going to be when sooner or later I want to move the Fox or whatever to a next owner? So many fellas out there who want good vintage guns but only with good dimensions and mechanics and at bargain basement pricing. It's basically a Buyer's marker and getting more so as older gents pass and younger ones have little interest in Fox gun nuances. frank

Steggy, Frank gave me a "C" Grade on a recent off line question. Tough teacher.

I agree with all of the above especially the dying interest in vintage SxS. In my opinion from my gun club, there is a somewhat interest in SxS but not vintage. It's about a shooter SxS and the CZ or Beretta or Stevens line. A few have true vintage (there is one 20g SW open choked all original that was member's grandfathers gun that I would like to have) but overall the view is a SxS is a SxS and they don't shoot as good/easy (harder to hit targets) than an O/U so not worth paying a premium. And younger hunters are looking for "how many shells can I load because more shots fired of 3" shells with 1 1/2" oz of shot means I have a better chance of downing the bird."

You may be correct in your evaluation of the vintage SxS market. But in my circle of friends the younger guys have a growing passion for vintage SxS shotguns and are not afraid to spend big money. I know the antique decoy market much better than the SxS market but many young heavy money collectors have been a real force in driving prices up to record levels. I hear the same from my insiders in the SxS auction market. Young collectors on the phone drive up prices for the best examples. The internet has changed everything, the average examples go down in value but the great stuff still finds strong bids. That being said you shouldn't consider collectibles an investment.

fox-admin wrote: ↑Tue Nov 21, 2023 4:46 pm

Silvers wrote: ↑Tue Nov 21, 2023 4:38 pm

Jeff S wrote: ↑Tue Nov 21, 2023 3:09 pm If my memory is correct, one of the founding fathers has an XE with a quail on the underside. Am I correct?

If I remember correctly one of our founding Life Members got a 26” XE 12 bore with a bird (quail, grouse?) in place of the fox. One of the guns from our friend the late Billy Harris. frank

Great memory Frank. Haven't heard from PP in a long time.

Thanks Craig, last I talked with PP was at Hausmann's NE SxS in 2022.

I found some notes from 2009 when I was offered and looked at that XE which had s/n 2905x. 26" with IC and Full chokes and a Kautzky in center position. The bird in the oval might have been a Pigeon, I'm foggy on that. Anyway it wasn't my cup of tea and I exercised restraint. Passed on the gun and I understand the gent we know bought it a month or so later. I don't know who has it now.

But I do distinctly remember another 12-gauge XE, 2 barrel set with a grouse in the oval, that was sent overseas by Fox. A family member contacted me for info and he sent pics. It sounded like it could be for sale and I was all hot over it but the import restrictions were an issue and in particular if the Dealer involved in the import might try to short cut me with the family owner. We corresponded for a while and he eventually didn't reply to my emails. As far as I know the XE still resides there. I'll try to find pics on my oldest laptop, now twice removed. frank

I like what Craig said, “you shouldn’t consider collectibles as an investment”.

New Years Eve will be here before you know it. My resolution will be to earn a “B” in 2024. I’m confident that I can do it.

I'm waiting on a 34" DE; have the perfect case for it.

Here is 24466 with two quail.

I should clarify, my assessment on the lack of interest in vintage SxS wasn't so much from a collector's standpoint (I think there will always be a market for vintage collectibles of any kind) but rather interest in just having a vintage workhorse SxS for upland or waterfowl hunting.

The last 2 pheasant seasons in MA I have hunted quite a bit and have run into many other hunters. I have seen probably 20-30 SxS and can recall a Fox SW and an A Grade, an LCS Field, and a Winchester 24. I didn't see a single Parker or Lefever or Ithaca. All others were either older Stevens/equivalent or recent modern CZ or similar.

There is a local gun shop that typically has 8-12 used SxS on a rack ranging in price from $300 for an old Sears to $1500+ for something like a recent Beretta. What sells used are the low priced Sears/Stevens and the high price Beretta, or a new CZ. Those fly off the shelf. The $500-$800 range for a good honest used SW, Nitro, LCS field or NID just sits there unsold for months.

Same for something like a Model 12. There are several 12g and a nice 16g all priced in the $400-$700 range and what sells are 870s at the $300-$400 price point and Benelli or Beretta autoloaders at the $700+ price point.

I stop in this place twice a week during lunch just to check things out and I get to see what is selling and what is not. And the store does quite the business. Every time I stop in no matter what time there are always 2-3 guns/customers waiting to be processed.