OGCA Fox Sightings

[Foxnut]

Attended the Ohio Gun Collectors Association show this past weekend. Good attendance and activity. The Winchesters Collector’s and the German Gun Collector’s Associations had great displays with some great guns. Saw several nice Fox guns including a flat out mint 20 gauge Sterlingworth and a nice 12 gauge XE w/BT forend. Also saw a nice 12 gauge A grade 12 gauge, a 30 inch gun w/very good condition and unmolested.

One of the most intriguing Fox guns I handled was a Frankenstein gun that was an amalgamation of a BE grade frame, a C grade floor plate, Kautsky SST, an ejector forend w/mismatched serial numbers and a set of 30 inch mismatched serial number barrels. The comb of the stock had been spliced to add height and made into a Monte Carlo stock. Funny thing was the gun looked pretty darn good. I thought it would be a hoot to shoot that gun, especially around Halloween!!

Also got to Visit w/SPE a couple of times as well. I didn’t come home w/any new guns but had a good time connecting with friends and seeing some nice guns. There were OGCA members from Ohio, Indiana, New York, PA,, WV, IL, TN, KY and other states as well.

[fox-admin]

Sounds like fun. I have only been once. Did a Fox did play with Dana and Tom. What a group of Fox guns

[Foxnut]

Wow, Wow, Wow! Now that is a display!! What a table of guns! I’d love to see Fox Nation do a display at the OGCA Display show once again!

[Silvers]

Over many years the past and current BD's did displays like that at their personal expense at the larger SxS events and Collector shows, in large part to enlist new members. So we've done that and last I heard we have > 500 annual and life members. And what did those efforts gain for the Association as compared with 10-12 years ago when we had about 200 members? Actually it seems inverse ..... instead of an increase in enthusiasm and activity, the number of active contributors on this website has dropped off over the past few years to about a dozen or so, and that includes former BD members. And at the same time comparatively few Fox shooters show up at larger SxS events and it's been a problem getting even 5 good Foxers to compete against other maker teams. That's versus 30-40 Fox shooters at events years ago. Way more members but less enthusiasm; how does that make sense? Net, a question: what would be the likely gain for the AHFCA's effort and expenses to do a good display at the OGCA or similar venues? Gain more members to do what? Ha ha! Time will tell in a few days to see how many of our Lifers step up and nominate by Sept 30 for the BD position that will be absent starting next year. frank

[Foxnut]

Frank, your points are all well taken. I have done several Fox displays at local shoots at my own expense, time and trouble. My personal goal when I do these is to bring awareness to others about A.H. Fox guns and try to encourage shooting, hunting and collecting Fox guns. Yes, time and expense but you never know when that one spark goes off to engagement w/Fox guns and perhaps this group. I also think we need to encourage younger shooters/hunters to give this corner of the sport a try. I personally think it’s worth it. Brett

[MARSHFELLOW]

Thanks for digging out those pictures Craig. That was a one-time hellacious display in depth, breadth & QUALITY ! I remember Dana being amazed/disappointed on how few attendees really paid attention to the display as a whole. I still miss him to this day.
tjw

[fox-admin]

What I have experienced from my many years associated with the AHFCA is displays of high condition guns don't to spur folks to join the
the AHFCA. Most people only really care about guns they own or guns for sale. Many new members are already the owner of a Fox gun, in many cases passed down from a relative. They join to get a copy of the factory card, learn some basic history. In many cases they never intend to shoot their Fox. Another group of new members are bird hunters that have gravitated to classic SxS's. They are normally one gun Fox owners with no interest in collecting or competitive shooting. Again, they just want to learn more about their Fox. These types of members only remain members for a year or two and move on. We will never see most of them at events and they make up most of our 40% member turnover every year.
Our core group of members have been members for a decade or more. It is a very diverse group of hard core collectors/hunters/shooters and very few have ever attended an event or posted on the forum. They have no interest in taking an active roll either by personal preference or lack of time. The smallest group are the active members that attend gun shows, post frequently and attend shooting events. With so many SXS shoots around the country in recent years, few travel more than a few hours to an event these days. Facebook Groups have also attracted many potential members, it's free. Craig

[Maggiemollie]

Good points. From a newbie perspective.

First, I was apprehensive about joining out of fear I would be laughed at because I knew nothing AND was someone who bought a lowly used SW rather than a mint condition graded gun. I joined anyway and proved that assumption false -Everyone here is great. However, I did prove that assumption is true on another site and it wasn't Parker.

Second, many "younger" folks still have to work and have to pick and choose how they will allocate vacation. I would love to go to the southern and other shoots but that turns into a 3 day out of work trip for me. I'd rather go to Hausmanns and Rock shoots taking 2 days off total plus they are within a 5hr drive. I have other activities I want to use vacation and even then I lose about 1wk available vacation simply due to work demands.

Lastly, and this may sound stupid, but the name of the site is the A.H. Fox COLLECTORS Association. "Collectors" reinforces the first misconception.

I say that because I shoot with quite a few people who shoot SxS - some American classics, some English, some European, some no name. I have mentioned the Fox, Parker, LCS, and Lefever sites to many and get the same type of response - "I'm not a collector" or "I like to shoot my guns" or "mine aren't all original". Basically, they assume #1 is true and don't take a chance.

Example, I shoot trap with one guy who shoots SxS exclusively and has a nice quiver so SxS - some really nice Model 21's, plus graded early Parkers, Ithaca, Lefever, Wesley Richardson, and others. Most are not 100% original and have had new stocks fitted for him for shooting purposes and other cosmetic improvements and/or repairs. But they look really nice. His comment to me about these sites or going to a SxS shoot was, "those folks would hate these guns because they aren't original".

I don't have answers other than the message needs to be clarified that it's not about collecting it's about owning and being proud you have a Fox whether a never fired D grade or beat up SW.

Lastly lastly, and this is by no fault of anyone here, Parker has a mystique that owning one makes you special so it doesn't really matter the grade/condition - owning a Parker makes you special. Not sure Fox can combat that but I do think the perception in other SxS is condition condition condition not joy of ownership.

Personally, I am trying to organize an expedition of 6-7 folks to either Hausmanns or Rock next year even if it includes O/U shooters. These guys are local skeet, trap, and SC shooters and I have been telling them about these events and hopefully it will come to fruition.

[Jeff S]

Good points. From a newbie perspective.

Personally, I am trying to organize an expedition of 6-7 folks to either Hausmanns or Rock next year even if it includes O/U shooters. These guys are local skeet, trap, and SC shooters and I have been telling them about these events and hopefully it will come to fruition.

Great idea! Your friends might arrive with O/U’s and leave with SxS’s. I hope they come along with you next year.

[Jeff S]

This thread was originally about the Ohio show, but it’s morphing into a discussion about shows in general. As the BOD member responsible for the Fox Booth, I’ll offer my 2 cents worth.

When at events, I love shooting with everyone, but I also thoroughly enjoy greeting members at the booth. Both aspects of an event are equally rewarding.

Many times I’ve heard that Fox guys don’t shoot or hunt with their guns enough. And, as Craig pointed out, a table full of “mint” guns might be nice to look at, but doesn’t necessarily draw people to the booth.

It seems like we want more shooters “chatting” about their guns, and their experiences. Three weeks ago I started laying out my plans for the booth at the Southern. Rather than focusing on “long legged” guns, or “light weight” upland guns, the theme is going to be, “Working Guns”. If a gun is going to be on display on the table it must be accompanied by a picture of the gun next to harvested game. I’ve put together 4 “display cards” for a variety of my guns, and will make two more this Fall. If someone would like to add to the display, they are welcome. I will post an invitation to participate in the display, but some of the display items won’t be ready until mid-November.

Why do I want to do this? Because I’m hoping that members will walk into the booth and talk about how they use their Fox shotguns. Ultimately, this is a very friendly group and I welcome each and everyone of you to stop by the booth and show a picture of your gun, in the field. As Daryl always says, “Owning a Fox is not a spectator sport”.

Below is an initial draft of one of the display cards. I will be happy to create one for every gun on the table.

[MARSHFELLOW]

Yup, A.H. Fox COLLECTORS Association.......... thats why I joined and have remained a member for years.
tjw

[Silvers]

Let's remember this Association has a three-part objective:

Article II. Objective
The objective of this club shall be (1) to stimulate and educate members and the public in
the history and production of the A.H. Fox shotgun; (2) to encourage the value of good
sportsmanship to shooter and collector members and the public; (3) promote a positive,
responsible use of firearms to members and the public.

(1) speaks to the collector aspect
(2) refers to shooters and collectors
(3) speaks to shooters

I fully understand why gents may have joined up primarily for Objective (1) and it seems to me that we've attracted and have morphed to satisfy a very large percentage of those folks. People have reasons for that primary interest and I'm happy if the Association is meeting what you're looking for.

But over the same time what used to be a large segment of those interested in shooting (and by extension hunting) has dwindled as they've gone away or choose not to join and share at least not here. And in my mind that's an "Opportunity Area" for our leadership. Hopefully support for all three Objective areas will be reevaluated with the upcoming new BD member and the shifting of roles within our leadership group. A reminder that nominations are due in a few days, by September 30.

Some long time members may discount these comments from one of the Founding Life Members who's been here even before Day One. If so that's your right.

Last comment: I'll paraphrase a question we've been hearing in the US media: Do you feel better today about the AHFCA and its emphasis on your personal interests than you did in years past?

frank

[DarylC]

Craig: You hit the nail on the head!

Fred: You bring your friends to Hausmann's or Rock Mountain and I'll make sure they have a Fox to shoot.

Jeff: That is a great idea. We can start in SD with some pics.

Frank: Your points are well taken. I want to remain optimistic for at least our one shoot a year at Hausmann's. I want to come up with some interesting games for Fox shooters to play, hang out around the BoWhoop table and trade stories, and give that first time attendee the feeling that he/her is welcome and give them the opportunity to shoot a Fox gun. All I know is I see a lot of smiling faces around that table and that's enough reason for me to do it. It's about the guys first, then the guns. Convincing someone to become a member if only to learn more about their grandfather's gun is only the beginning. Bringing them into the fold is more easily done with that social connection.

[fox-admin]

It seems to me the lack of participation and enthusiasm are the challenge team events. We have tried different qualifying strategies to try to draw more people in, it has helped with fill out a squad but not everyone is happy with the selection format. The best events in terms of participants was the Fox small bore challenge shot on the Hausmann 5 stand with a cash prize for the top 3 scores and the BW. The BW continues to be a well supported event. These are not team events but seem to meet the needs of the attendees. Maybe someone can figure out why the team challenge events are poorly supported and make modifications.

[44whiskey]

my ramblings; here, as Frank predicted, we see some of the core group of regulars posting.i always look forward to what each of you have to say.Frank spoke of the regulars posting new acquisitions,hunting,and events.as in this period of my life i am not doing any of those things,i have nothing to offer other than the occasional anecdote that a post may bring to mind. i am on no other social media, and am reluctant to share a story here when its off on a tangent of what OPs topic might have been.truth be told we are mostly a bunch of old white guys here for the shared love of SXSs and i for one would enjoy reading some of the members old tales. fred ps most of the time there are less than 25 members on line and a lot of those are bots,there was a period in late june for a few days with record numbers on the site peaking at 270.any idea why ,if known we may attract more participation with more of the same. special thanks to Jeff for regular post that keep the conversation going