2.5" 16ga. shells for Pheasants

[whisperbow]

I have two more posts related to the old 16ga. Sterlingworth I just bought. One of the posts was using 2 3/4" shells and everyone advised on the side of caution to use low-pressure 2.5" so is there a good pheasant load in that selection? I would think not because after 50+ years of pheasant hunting many time it is hard to bring down a bird dead. This last weekend in Kansas was proof again.
Si

[FoxintheHenHouse]

I don't think RST has exactly what you are looking for in 16 gauge. Sometimes, as each hunting circumstance predicts, you can either pass on all but the closest shots or switch to a gun that can handle the job. Many times I have pulled my 3" Winchester 21 20 gauge from the safe to do the heavy hitting with no pressure worries.

FoxintheHenHouse

[Researcher]

Better dogs so you are not taking those 40 and 50 yard shots.

[loggy]

Planted birds help

[fox-admin]

I have hunted wild pheasants in SD for three years now over good to great dogs. Our group of 5 are all sxs shooters and no one uses a gun larger than a 16. I use 20ga 7/8 RST paper #6 and have had no problem killing birds. This year we took 57 pheasants and lost 2 over 4 days. I light fast gun is the ticket. You need to get on birds fast. We let any wild 50 yard flushes go. This year we had 25 to 30 mph winds and still had success with small bores.

[loggy]

Craig, it sounds sounds like you had a great hunt with a group of responsible hunters. I see why you go back! John

[whisperbow]

Thanks for all your replies especially the South Dakota Story. It helps my confidence and this weekend in Kansas we did experience many out--of range birds. I bet you guys also enjoyed your light well-balanced doubles on those long walks!!

[SXS ohio]

I also own a light little Fox Sterly 30" tubes M/F, its a light 5-lbs 12oz. The shotgun is in hi condition made in the first year of production with number 4 weight barrels and a small 20-gauge frame. I had Brad Bachelder open the chambers and cones to give me more choices of factory loaded ammo. I would say that 1165 or 1200 FPS is about the hot-est loads I want to use in it as recoil can be a bit harsh! Problem is I love 5 shot for rooster huntin and no one loads them anymore...)-: I still have some boxes of B&P 1oz 5 loads 1200 FPS that I have been shooting and it works good, also two cases of RST lights also in 5 shot, both are loaded in short hulls, both discontinued at this time. Still roosters are hard to kill outright, they can run like hell and seem to vanish. The soft shooting loads do not allow for poor shooting or long shots. If I do my part and the shots are not long, birds are DOA. I tend to shoot a couple inches low with the SW due to the drop at the comb being lower than my front line shotguns that I normally shoot...so I must pay close attention to my sight picture on birds to center them. I think if my gun fit me properly all this would go away and I could point and shoot natural and the gun and load would be fine. By next season I will get the stock modified so the comb is about 1/4" up. Number 6 shot is available from RST in short shells but I would not be apposed to shooting 2-3/4" shells out of 6lb Fox gun if its in good shoot-able condition with factory spec bores. With 1165 loads, 2-3/4" loads will have no ill effect on short chamber guns. Chambers can always be lengthened as I did with no loss of value to your hunting gun that will be a used gun and not a mint safe queen. I find that reloading for 16 gauge is fun and rewarding if a fella has time to do that. The best place to get needed components is Ballistic Products and Graf & Sons wholesale. I use a Mec 600 JR press and they offer short kits if you want to mess with 2 5/8" loads. SXS Ohio....(-: 10 days till Kansas!

[Fin2Feather]

I'd guess that 1oz 6's are far and away the most popular load for 16ga pheasant hunting. Wonder why manufacturers producing 2.5" shells have made them so hard to come by? I still have a few boxes of 1oz RST's in both 5 & 6 which I will be rationing.

If you don't mind shooting a few 2-3/4" in your guns (and that's another can of worms), Herter's (Cabela's) lists a 16ga load at 1165fps in #6.

[Silvers]

Just my thoughts here ..... I wouldn't think of hunting pheasants with a 16 bore SxS without having something equivalent to an old time 2-3/4 "high brass" Winchester Super Speed load in the left barrel = 1-1/8 ounce at 1295 fps. And if the birds were flying wild, in both barrels. That's a real deal speed, not advertising hype velocity as we sometimes read today. I've seen too many birds with shallow wounds when using so-called "low pressure" shells. Nuff said

Anyone who does some clays practice shooting should be able to handle that load for those few shots while actually hunting with a lightweight Fox 16 bore at about 6 pounds. Personally I don't fret about recoil effect on "old dry wood" IN A FOX. Also if the Fox was short chambered, I'd get it measured for wall thickness and if OK, open the chambers to 2-3/4".

For members of the AHFCA, there's a thread in the Members Forum that talks about a special chamber reamer I had made to Fox/Utica 16-gauge specs.

frank

[fox-admin]

From my experience the key to wild pheasant hunting is great dogs and not so much the gun or shell. With good dogs magnum shells are not required in my experience in both north and south Dakota over many years. I would not even attempt to chase pheasants without great dogs. I suppose if you hunt without dogs or poor dogs more firepower would help. Some guys think you can't kill a pheasant without using magnum 4's that has not been my experience. This year our group never shot anything but 7/8oz #6's. We shot 57 birds and lost 2.

[SXS ohio]

A gun that fits and shells that have good patterns from it is the key. Few hunters test fire the loads they hunt with to see if patterns are consistent with no shot clusters and vacant spots. I like number 5 shot, it penetrates better than smaller pellets and I find less bb-s when I clean my birds. It also works great on Kansa quail too. If I'm on the bird drops, don't need 7 1/2 shot. My Favorite rooster load in my CSMC Fox is Fiocchi HV-5 1-1/8 oz at 1300 SXS Ohio

[Silvers]

From my experience the key to wild pheasant hunting is great dogs and not so much the gun or shell. With good dogs magnum shells are not required in my experience in both north and south Dakota over many years. I would not even attempt to chase pheasants without great dogs. I suppose if you hunt without dogs or poor dogs more firepower would help. Some guys think you can't kill a pheasant without using magnum 4's that has not been my experience. This year our group never shot anything but 7/8oz #6's. We shot 57 birds and lost 2.

Craig, just to clarify since you mentioned magnum twice. I cited the 16-gauge Winchester Super Speed load with 1-1/8 ounce at 1295 speed. That was one of the standard "high brass" shells in common use and on par with high brass shells made by Peters, Remington, Western and Federal. The 16-gauge magnum was much stiffer, loaded with 1-1/4 ounce of shot.

Regarding bird dogs, I agree that good dogs will increase the kill. However not everyone that hunts pheasants has dogs, good or bad, and there are some who choose to hunt without them.

[foxgun]

I'm heading to SD tomorrow for 5 days, planning to shoot 12 ga CE Mod/Full with some reloads of nickel plated 5's 1 1/8oz at about 1250-1275fps. We will see how it goes but I'll bet if I'm on em they'll drop and if not they won't. I think practice all year on clays with the gun I'm going to shoot makes much more difference than the load I use. Really looking forward to it!

[Silvers]

Looking at this a little differently, one reference shows average weights about the same for a ringneck at 2-3/4 pounds and a drake mallard at 2-1/2 pounds. Shots at either specie can be close (dogs or decoyed respectively) or far away on skittish birds. It follows that the ammunition used should be about the same. Of course the pheasant gun will be carried over hill and dale and thus a lighter weight is desirable. Now let's talk about that ammunition and killing power. In the old days (pre non-tox) very few would be hunting waterfowl with a 16 bore using 7/8 ounce or even 1 ounce "low brass" field loads at moderate velocity. Most duck hunters would take the 12 bore and 1-1/4 ounce high brass loads @ 1330 fps. But if a 20 or 16 was the only gun the old time gent owned, or the one he wanted to use, he'd probably be using high brass/high velocity loads such as Super Speeds, Super-X, Peters H.V. etc. For 16-gauge that's 1-1/8 ounce at 1295 speed.

Similarly most gents who do vintage waterfowling nowadays, decoyed and pass shooting, will reach for the 12-gauge SxS and heavy bismuth or better yet tungsten matrix shells, or equivalent handloads. But often the same gents when hunting pheasants will use "low pressure" loads with much lighter shot charges at relatively low velocity that are more suited to clays shooting. Doesn't make sense to me.

frank