late 16 gauge S/W factory BT forearm

[Dennis Potter]

I think the cross brace in Silvers forend it the best indicator or originality. Most if not all aftetmarket beavertails I have seen do not have it. And it is necesssary to retain the wood in shooting the gun. I am not positive, but I think some braces carried the serial number of the gun.
The brace is the metal that protrudes on each side of the forend iron when looking down into the forend off the gun. About 1/4 x 1/4 on each side, towards the rear. The screw from the rear of the radius goes into it. The brace is one piece and goes around and under the forend iron and ejector springs.

[Researcher]

I call it a yoke. It is certainly the norm on Savage-era ejector beavertail forearms, but I have not seen it on extractor guns with beavertails. On the other hand, I've also seen them on quite a few slim ejector forearms, all six of the Savage-era ejector forearms I own, four slim and two beavertail. Here you can see the yoke on the forearm for my 12-gauge Fox-Sterlingworth Ejector Skeet & Upland Game Gun --

Fox-Sterlingworth Deluxe Ejector Field, beavertail forearm

They are certainly superior to that Philadelphia era woodscrew into that very thin web of wood in ejector forearms.

[Bird1122]

Gentlemen,

Another example to consider. The following photos are of an '83 Bielin restock of which no notes are included in the receipt as to the style requested. I am left to conclude that this is an example of Mitzie's standard for the era rather than Savage's last style. BTW, the blue and the cyanide colors are Mitzie's (or sub'd) and the BT forend set the owner back $25. If anyone is interested I can share more of the work and the rates.

Shoot straight,

Bird

The gun...


The bead...


The carving aft of the "plateau area"...


The checkering...


The escutcheon...

[MARSHFELLOW]

Very interesting....thanks for sharing that.

tjw

[Silvers]

Bird, thanks for taking the time to post. Your info adds much to our knowledge of Mitzie's work. Just wondering, does your forend have the crossbrace feature?

So now I'm thinking this 16 gauge SW Ejector gun I posted here earlier may have been in Mitzie's shop too. Take a look at this pic and compare with the last one posted by Bird, i.e., atypical engraving on the f/e screw anchor. Both engravings appear to be ~ the same. I'm also including a full view of the gun. This gun may have the record of being in all three Fox places over its life.... she has the Fox Phila proof, Savage/Utica proof and chamber marking, and maybe Mitzie's fingerprint on the f/e anchor. Hummm ?!?! Silvers

[Bird1122]

Silvers,

If I am correct, no. My third picture does not match Researcher's example of a cross-braced forend iron (second from right). Am I right?

Also, I mistakenly thought that my gun was an ejector when I viewed pictures prior to purchasing it. The escutcheon led me to this error. Am I right to conclude now that properly stocked/assembled SW extractor BT forends utilize the escutcheon as the extractor forend iron attachment?

Shoot straight,

Bird

[Silvers]

Bird, yes the crossbrace is as shown on Researcher's pics, second from right. Also as shown on the past pic I posted on page 1 of this thread. Sorry, I don't know the Savage era factory norm for screw anchors in extractor beavertail forends on Sterlingworths. I don't remember seeing one I thought was righteous.

[Researcher]

I have some pictures along with all the Savage invoices and letters from 1969, concerning a Sterlingworth Field, serial number 107517, originally shipped July 13, 1927, to Wilkes Barre Hardware Company. The gun was sent to Savage for an extra set of 26-inch barrels bored cylinder and improved cylinder and beavertail forearms. The quoted price on September 11, 1969, was $213.15, including rechambering the original barrels to 2 3/4 inch, reproofing and rollstamping $15, and overhauling the action $26. But, in the end, when ready to ship on April 23, 1970, was $225.40. These extractor beavertail forearms have no escutchens, but I have no pictures of the inside to see if they have a yoke. Unfortunately my scanner is not working, so I can't show these pictures. As I recall, one could buy a pretty darn nice 12-gauge Sterlingworth for $100 in 1969, and smallbores for $125. These beavertail forearms have checkering that wraps around the forearm like those shown by Silvers and Bird1122, not the two panels like my 1936 gun --

Ejector forearms Philadelphia, Utica, Utica Beavertail

The letters were all signed by J.T. Callahan of the Arms Service Division. In one of the letters he states "Most Fox shotguns were chambered for 2 9/16 inch shells, and once they have been rechambered to accept 2 3/4 inch shells and the remainder of the shotgun is in tight mechanical order, they are quite safe to shoot with modern ammunition."

[Bird1122]

Marshfellow - You're welcome. A relatively meager contribution to the board, but my pleasure.

Silvers and Researcher - Thanks. So, quite possibly alterate options existing for this attachment? Yolk/cross-brace versus escutcheon?

In the end, the originality of the BT in question in this thread is judged more by the subtleties of the wood treatments?

[Silvers]

No, the crossbrace/yoke has a different purpose than the anchor/escutcheon. Crossbrace and its machine screw keep the forend tight against the front end of the ejector f/e iron knuckle. In comparison, the anchor was typically used as the forward attachment of the ejector f/e iron on SW's and some real early graded smallbores.

Here's a crossbrace setup that came on an ultra rare 1-frame Super Fox that was rebarreled at Savage. Just to show how the machine screw provides the tension. That's a better setup for ejector guns than the regular wood screw, same opinion as Dave commented earlier.

For casual readers here, I'll add that tech topics like this are common on the Members Forum. A better return on your money than buying a Fox tech book.... if one was available. Silvers

[SPE33]

While browsing thru the site this morning I happened upon this thread regarding beavertail forearms put on Fox guns.My
16 gauge SPE has such a forearm on it but it is not mentioned in the factory letter.I found a picture here of a Mitzie Bielen restock and noticed a remarkable similarity between that forearm and the one on my gun.Some differences such as the forearm bead and escutcheon but I believe the grade difference accounts for this,my gun being a SPE and the restocked gun being a Sterlingworth.My question for the more knowledgeable members is do any of you think there is a possibility that my forearm is a Bielen replacement?Also if it is,does this account for the fact that there is no serial number stamped on the inside of the forearm?There is a picture of the forearm in question in the photo section and I have a few more to view if someone would be able to post them for me. Pictures of your Fox......16 ga.SPE grade.
Thanks in advance for your help and input.

[bbman3]

I have never seen a yoke that was made for an extractor forend only made for ejectors forends.I have several new old stock ones for 12 gauge and small bores. Bobby

[SPE33]

My gun has ejectors and the forend yoke is there.

[16ga.Ray]

I am getting some photos and not others--anyone have an explanation?

16ga.ray

[Fin2Feather]

I am getting some photos and not others--anyone have an explanation?

16ga.ray

Photobucket has gone to a pay-to-post system and has blocked photos by those who don't pay up. The photos you are getting are posted by some other method or hosting site.